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<table border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="100%" class="forumline"> <tr> <th class="thCornerL" width="22%" height="26">Author</th> <th class="thCornerR">Message</th> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>cheapbag214s</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="http://picsrv.fora.pl/subSilver/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Sun 14:20, 06 Oct 2013<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: Handbagger Harman v Grumpy Gove-spun2 Nike Blazer</span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">Handbagger Harman v Grumpy Gove <br />Much light as well as fierce heat in last night's BBC2 Newsnight clash between Harriet Harman and Michael Gove over the riots,[url=http://parajumpersoutletitalia.albirank.net/][b]parajumpers outlet[/b][/url]. The revealing video(well worth a watch if you've not seen it) is here and this is a good summary by The Guardian. <br />I've been critical of both HH and GG recently but they were on top form. The unity ended after condemning the violence. Harman, Labour's Deputy Leader, isn't afraid to raise important social and economic issues which many of her Shadow Cabinet colleagues(including Ed Miliband?) would prefer to ignore at the moment. Gove, the Education Secretary, prefers to focus on law and order though on that performace he needs to go on an anger management course. <br />My verdict? Win for Harman. Political risk raising wider questions(as Gove tried to exploit) but why so many disaffected youths/people go on the rampage isn't answered by restricting debate to police tactics and denunciations of looting. <br />Having watched the feud, I think the issue centres on a blurring of the line between explanation, on the one hand, and justification, on the other. It is probably true that the riots and looting can be explained, in many cases,[url=http://billigeparajumpersjackendamen.albirank.net/][b]parajumpers long bear[/b][/url], by more factors than mere wanton criminality. But do those explanations justify it? Harriet Harman was blurring that line; Gove most certainly was not. And the reason she was blurring that line between explanation and justification was not to 'risk raising wider questions', as Maguire sympathetically suggests, but to score political points. <br />As always the ruling classes like to have simple and unequivocal explanations for anything that occurs in society,[url=http://duveticapiuminiitalia.webmium.com/][b]Duvetica Piumini[/b][/url]. They don't want ragged trousered philantropists like Rods from having to think too deep into the causes of any civil unrest. God forbid . ,[url=http://billigtmonclerdunjackastockholmrea.olimx.com/][b]Moncler Jacka[/b][/url]. . he may eventually have to exercise his intellect and ponder why these events periodically occur. <br />I also think that Harriet won hands down and exposes Gove for what he is . . . a member of a tory-led government who does not want to accept any accountability or responsibility for the carnage that erupted onto our streets. Gove's indignation was carefully rehearsed in an attempt by tory central office to deflect the blame away from them. Again, the whole affair was poorly managed by the government who appeared completely unaware of the scale of the problem. Sounds familiar doesn't it. A government being led and not leading. On this occasion it was the the good citizen's of Clapham, Enfield and Peckham defending their properties rather than being reliant on an effective government machinery. It's no wonder that things went pear-shaped with the pygmy Hague at the helm. <br />The incompetence of this government has been exposed yet again. <br />Squealer - why does Gove need to go on an anger management course? He is dealing with one of the most sanctimonious politicians I've ever seen who sat there trying to blame the entire riots on current Government policies that haven't even started to take effect yet. As Gove rightly pointed out the Labour government are to blame entirely for the environment these youngster's have grown up in. <br />The whole purpose of of Harriet's,[url=http://woolrichswedense.albirank.net/][b]http://woolrichswedense.albirank.net/[/b][/url], Ken Livingstone's and Lee Jasper's current rhetoric is to deflect the scrutinising eyes away from the abject failure of the Labour Government's term in office and lay the blame at the current Government's feet. Listening to the excuses given by a number of rioters it is hysterical how they have jumped onto the band wagon of justifying their behaviour because of Tory policies that they can't even explain. <br />Unfortunately squealer journos of your ilk that continually mislead with your agenda driven reporting rather than a desire for real discussion or truth perpetuate the belief systems that give rise to the comments of the young that be summed up as "it ain't my fault" <br />Now looking at the comments that have been unleashed across many a discussion board of pure racist hate you can see how dictatorships/police states come about but supposedly educated people such as yourself Kevin, fail to see how you contribute to the rise of totalitarianism or loss of democracy. <br />Kevin - you are either a very clever manipulator or a deluded fool,[url=http://parajumpersoutletitalia.albirank.net/][b]parajumpers Parka Piumini online shop[/b][/url]. I err towards the latter having read or listened to your comments over a number of years now,[url=http://woolrichoutletitalia.halod.com/][b]http://woolrichoutletitalia.halod.com/[/b][/url]. <br />Win for Batty Hatty Harperson? LOL! You need to stop watching with red tinted glass and Red Flag playing at full volume full in the background because Gove ripped Harperson to shreds. She was doing exactly what she had been accused of doing - talking out of both sides of her mouth. Your criticism of Ed Milliband for not using these riots for political advantage is dead wrong. He has been weak and shown again how he should never be PM but the likes of Harperson and Livingshitestone trying to blame the crisis on cuts that haven't even happened while it's still going on is disgraceful. Interesting to note how even many Guardian readers thought Gove was right to slam Batty Hatty for her sanctimonious drivel, snide comments and two faced treachery. <br />Gove win by devastating KO,[url=http://duveticaaustraliaoutlet.halod.com/][b]duvetica jackets aliaoutlet outlet[/b][/url], 5-0, straight sets and a country mile. <br />But welcome back Squealer,[url=http://monclerjackasverige.albirank.net/][b]moncler Jackor återförsäljare[/b][/url], I've missed your ranting. <br />Kevin, you are miles off calling that an HH win. Gove won that debate by a mile "footlocker fresh trainers" a classic line and in the process made HH (Browns no 2 architect for this situation) look ridiculous. I'm from a north london inner city council estate with loads of family and friends still trapped amongst the drug dealing thieving minority scum and you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Its your "do gooder" politics getting the better of you and clouding your normally balanced judgement mate. I only wish folks like you had a chance to live bang in the middle of the commotion and terrifying atmosphere as i did. Sad that even when all the facts are argued as coherently as Gove did that folks like you still can't see it. Shame on you. Lets see if you post this? <br />We would just like to say how nice it was to see the young folk of today getting out in the fresh air and getting stuck into activities that they'd learnt from role models like our banking boys. It was a joy to see such fit and healthy teenagers nimbly jumping in and out of shops, when we hear so much about the youth of today being obese. 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